New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Press J to jump to the feed. Disadvantages: Relatively difficult to sharpen, can be prone to chipping in certain applications. Spyderco Delica 4 EDC Folding Knife – Amazon. Chris Reeve is famous for developing two steels directly with Crucible Industries, and boy did this partnership result in an awesome product. CPM-S30V has become one of the most used premium steels on the market among knife manufacturers. Martensitic is a specific type of stainless steel alloy. In fact, CPM M4 exhibits the best toughness properties of any high speed steel we currently produce, conventional or CPM. However, S30V is still considered to be a superior choice for knife making. CPM-20CV. I saw s30v as a good mid range folding knife steel and s35 as a good mid range fixed(5-6 inch) blade steel, but nothing really stands out about them. Several well known knife makers participated in the development/research including: Phil Wilson, Sal Glesser, Ernest Emerson, Tony Marfione, William Harsey Jr., … CPM-M4: A high-speed tool steel, this is a really tough steel with good edge retention. Martensitic is a specific type of stainless steel alloy. The large difference is that M4 has a ton of tungsten and molybdenum so it's harder and tougher than S30V at the expense of corrosion resistance. How?? M4 will probably develop a patina over a long time as it's not a stainless steel while you don't really have to worry about S30V. The resulting steel is expected to have similar hardness and corrosion resistance to S30V and S35VN. I do agree that cpm m4 continues to impress & is underrated. The back bevel can be about as low as you want. Spyderco Counterfeits, Clones, Replicas, etc. CPM s90v Wear Resistance: Excellent Wear Resistance, with 9% of Vanadium, the steel is very hard and durable. ZDP and S30V loose the scary sharp edge really fast; but S30V keeps it "secondairy razor edge" longer then ZDP189 (shouldn't that be the other way around ?). The most important thing I've found to help me is with ZDP-189 I have to keep a edge angle at least 36° inclusive, preferrable 40°. The edge still cut paper like I had just finished stropping it. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Yea in a true apples-to-apples comparison those steels are very different. Honestly, I doubt the average user will be able to tell the diff. CPM S30V is tougher (i.e. SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT, "If you wish to live and thrive, let the spider run alive", "the perfect knife is the one in your hand, you should just learn how to use it. I will not get into the data sheet details on the products, other than to say that S30V is a high carbon steel alloyed with chromium, molybdenum and vanadium. For even more fun, throw in S90v, and M390. ZDP will hold that scary sharp edge longer, you must take more care in developing your edge. I've gotten to a point that all I care about is the ease & ability to take a fine edge. Unlike,say,CPM-D2 which came after regular D2. S30V and S35VN overview. Your findings do not match the datasheets or the general consensus, but that does not mean you're wrong. Ask questions or share something you know that I don't. Also; are there recommendations as to which angle you best sharpen which steel? I live witht hte angles my VG10 blades come with (as long as they are less than 30 inclusive) but make sure they have a good micro bevel, until I reprofile to 30. Composition Comparison Graph For The Knife Steels Crucible CPM S110V, Crucible CPM S30V, Crucible CPM S90V Version 4.36 In 2009, Crucible Steel introduced an update to CPM-S30V to meet the needs of renowned knife maker Chris Reeve that they called CPM-S35VN. I prefer M4 over S30V. Wait, I think the Air will have M4. S30V is, in many eyes, the ultimate EDC steel. CPM 4V Powder Metal Tool Steel. One of the most important factors in edge retention is your usage of the knife. All else equal, I would go with S30V over D2 without hesitation. There is a powder form, CPM-D2, and PSF27 is also very chemically similar. The steel looks somewhat similar to S35VN but with increased Nb and N, decreased C and V, and a 1.5% cobalt addition. The CPM S30V (an acronym for Crucible Particle Metallurgy) is a quality, high endurance steel of American origin. Whereas S30V steel is what is considered to be stainless steel meaning that it will be more restitant if not 100% rust and corrosion resistant. Honestly I don't think you'd have to sharpen either after two weeks unless you're using it to break down entire semi's worth of cardboard every few days. M4 is a tool steel, S30V was designed as a great all around knife steel. I live down in coastal Ga with very salty humid air. Edit: Anyone correct me if my information is off. This lessens micro chipping and the edge seems to last longer. The Sebenza 21. The main thing is to find a knife with ergonomics that you like, at a price point that you like. I have really enjoyed playing with edge angles in the past 2-3 years. M4 is awesome. CPM S30V is very popular steel by Crucible. That means going for a tough steel like CPM 3V for a chopper, an edge retention focused steel like CPM S30V for your folders, and a super stainless steel like H1 or X15TN for your marine-use blades. I find this to be a good guideline for the "super" steels available now. M4 in every performance metric except corrosion resistance and resharpening ease. Search for: m4 steel vs s30v. CPM S30V. I was hoping that it would keep that scarp sharp edge longer, turns out it doesn't. S30V … Looks like you have it all figured out already. Many really good fixed blades come in 1095. What it is: CPM S30V is a "Crucible Particle Metallurgy" stainless steel, widely regarded as a "super steel" for its properties and performance. ... better than D2 (which is a comparable tool steel used in knifemaking) at a hardness 60 RC. CPM S30V and CPM S35VN are closely related steels made by Crucible Industries. Despite its age, it’s a truly superior steel. level 2 There are better steels suitable for each job. To reiterate, I am not saying that supersteels … Not an expert by any means but I don't run VG10 under 15 a side, just doesn't work for me. A2. Despite having a “new and improved” version in the CPM S35, this steel is very good. CPM American Steels Both S35VN and S30V steels were developed in a collaboration between Chris Reeve and Crucible Industries, a New York-based steel manufacturer, using Crucible Particle Metal (CPM) technology. Advantages: Relative toughness, wear resistance. I don't know if Chris is the best or not, but he put out knives with this steel first. Looking to get a custom Griptilian but I’m not a steel expert by any means. It is also easier to machine and polish than CPM S30V. M4 will probably develop a patina over a long time as it's not a stainless steel while you don't really have to worry about S30V. What does it offer. Rare case of a steel designed as a cutlery steel. Postby alucardje » Fri May 25, 2012 6:02 am, Postby chuck_roxas45 » Fri May 25, 2012 6:19 am, Postby nullity » Fri May 25, 2012 6:33 am, Postby alucardje » Fri May 25, 2012 6:55 am, Postby phillipsted » Fri May 25, 2012 6:56 am, Postby Ankerson » Fri May 25, 2012 7:10 am, Postby jackknifeh » Fri May 25, 2012 7:34 am, Postby gull wing » Fri May 25, 2012 7:42 am, Postby Evil D » Fri May 25, 2012 11:20 am, Postby Zenith » Fri May 25, 2012 11:27 am, Postby Cliff Stamp » Fri May 25, 2012 5:22 pm, Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], jpm2, kingm, Wartstein and 28 guests. CPM technology helps to make homogeneous steel … That’s why dozens of knives makers use this steel. CPM s90v Sharpness: the better steel can hold an edge, the harder to sharpen it, the s90v is very hard steel, so sharpening or grinding won’t be an easy task. CPM Rex M4 HC Powder Metal High Speed Steel. However, I get the feeling that when you keep cutting, ZDP's lousy edge will eventually out-cut S30V. M4 I like the best but it isn't available on many Spyderco knives. CPM-S35VN. I've cut this stuff with different knives and this steel, edge angle, blade grind and the comfort of holding the Sage4 made very light work of slicing it up. (slack belt with a trizact A6 belt). Other than that I only use knives for every day use and extrememly low angles just aren't necessary. S30V and M4 are my favorites at the moment. So all those less steels are ok by me. CPM 4V is a powder metal tool steel with an outstanding combination of properties including high impact toughness and very good wear resistance. cpm m4 Automatic Knife Ordering Agreement IN COMPLIANCE WITH FEDERAL STATUTES , KnifeCenter, Inc requests that you read carefully the requirements set forth below, and agree to this prior to your purchase or receipt of any automatic opening knife from our company. S30V will be easier to sharpen. It can be hardened to around 62-64 HRC but note M4 is a carbon steel is not considered stainless with relatively low levels of chromium. Probably because I put a really scary sharp razor edge on all of my knives. CPM SPY27 is a steel produced by Crucible exclusively for Spyderco. CPM S30V Steel Composite Materials: Carbon 1.45%; Chromium 14%; Vanadium 4%; Molybdenum 2%; This steel contains slightly more carbon than the S35VN. CPM S30V will probably stay sharper longer than D2. Further, those models are pretty different so the results vary further. That and having to keep it oiled, and more likely than not the thumb ramp and opening hole turning black (see: used Gayle Bradleys) there isn't too much more to worry about. I know both are great and I’m not a hard user but I don’t want to sharpen it after 2 weeks of use. also I have never regularly oiled my M4 knives before, and rust does not seem to be a significant issue. CPM S30V(Crucible) - Developed in 2001, by Crucible. ", If you don't have anything good to say, then don't say anything at all, Blade steel; CPM-M4 vs VG-10 vs S30V vs ZDP-189, http://uproxx.files.wordpress.com/2014/ ... ot-gif.gif, http://www.youtube.com/user/mwvanwyk/videos. ZDP and S30V loose the scary sharp edge really fast; but S30V keeps it "secondairy razor edge" longer then ZDP189 ( shouldn't that be the other way around ?). I just put a 36° inclusive single bevel edge on my Sage4 (S30V). The latter is, of course, offset by the high wear resistance meaning infrequent sharpening. I have a handful of blades in S30V and they're very sharp, but my PM2 in M4 always cuts better. I have no experience with M4 so can’t attest to that one. M4 is quite a bit harder to sharpen than S30V.  Originally developed by both Chris Reeve (a world renowned knife maker) and Dick Barber of Crucible Industries, S30V is a martensitic powder-made stainless steel. Another fact known is that a reduced carbon and vanadium content would lead to a steel that was tougher and easier to grind because of a reduction in overall carbide content. CPM 3V Toughness & Wear Resistance vs D2, A2 & CPM M4 ... CPM 3V steel does not hold its edge as well as some other steels like S35VN or S30V. M4 is a tool steel, S30V was designed as a great all around knife steel. Part 1 of a CPM M4 geek out. The large difference is that M4 has a ton of tungsten and molybdenum so it's harder and tougher than S30V at the expense of corrosion resistance. Gayle Bradley and Manix2 are the only ones I know of. CPM M4 provides superbly balances levels of abrasion resistance and toughness through high doses of molybdenum (hence the “M”), vanadium and tungsten together with reasonably high levels of carbon. (takes a little longer). I'm not a huge fan of m4. Combined with its excellent wear resistant properties and good grindability (comparable to conventional M2) CPM M4 represents the best high performance “general purpose” high speed steel on the market today. While CPM-M4 keeps it's razor edge the longest, and deteriorates the slowest. The edge retention is likely a small step down from S35VN. neither will need sharpening after two weeks, but m4 will last longer. See more D2 steel knives. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. The lack of corrosion resistance is the deal breaker for me. m4 is not more prone to chipping. Overview. The addition of 0.5% Niobium, and reductions in both Carbon from (1.45% to 1.40%) and Vanadium (from 4% to 3%) produced an alloy with 25% increase in measured Charpy V-notch toughness over S30V (Crucible claims 15-20% … That is based on my experience which is very limited on different steels. Exhibiting very good edge retention, corrosion resistance, and sharpenability, S30V is utilized by a variety of makers for its performance and balance. It sliced through vinly siding VERY easily. S30V . In my experience, S30V takes and holds a hair-splitting edge. In my experience, it's easier to get a very thin, very sharp edge with CPM S30V than with D2. Perhaps S35VN will be a better solution. CPM S35VN is a martensitic stainless steel designed to offer improved toughness over CPM S30V. 30 inclusive with a 40 inclusive micro bevel is the lowest I go with VG10 and CPMs30V. Again, not common among production knives. December 11, 2020 Liste Liste It is a good all-around steel that will serve you well IMHO. It seems like s45vn is going to be a really good fixed blade steel(5-6 inch)….IF heat treated correctly….. CPM-M4. That has worked quite well on the majority of my cutting tasks, your cutting tasks may vary. American powdered steel is ... An air-hardenable non-stainless tool steel that has improved toughness and wear resistance over D2 steel. CPM-S30V. Well actually; I'm somewhat dissapointed in ZDP189. will tolerate impacts better). I have a handful of blades in S30V and they're very sharp, but my PM2 in M4 always cuts better. Certain materials and types of cutting techniques will dull some steels faster than others. Advantages: Wear resistance, corrosion resistance. A large volume of vanadium carbides provides the high wear resistance. Employ especially on knives, its abilities to retain edge sharpness and resist rust are superb. I think Crucible worked with Chris Reeve to develop this steel for knives and there is only one version of it, CPM-S30V. S60V, however, was essentially 440C but with 5.5% vanadium added and enough carbon to maintain similar hardness potential. CPM S30V is used in a wide range of ZT knives. As a general rule I like 36° edge angle with a 26° back bevel. S30V is, in many eyes, the ultimate EDC steel. S30V is BY FAR the most common of these. However, if you take good care of your D2 you will find that it will stay corrosion free and work just as well the S30V in this regard, although if you don’t want to spend a lot of time cleaning the blade then you would be better to go for s30v steel. CPM stands for Crucible Particle Metallurgy, I … harder steels usually chip more than softer ones but in this case the carbide composition in m4 allow for the same if not better edge stability than s30v. CPM S30V has superior resistance to corrosion than D2. CPM Rex M4 HC high-speed steel is an extremely versatile high speed steel that provides a unique combination of high wear resistance with high impact toughness and transverse bend strength.
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cpm m4 steel vs s30v 2021